Recently, Punk Globe got the chance to speak with Terry James Graham – drummer, of The Bags, The Gun Club. Terry Graham talks about his memoir – “Punk Like Me” and his years with The Gun Club, about his current band Apostle of Hex and upcoming plans, about "Miami" and "Fire Of Love". 

Punk Globe: On September 10 1977 you played your first show with The Bags at Masque club. Do you remember how you were feeling and tellus how important the Masque was at the time?

Terry: Actually, I played my first show with the Bags at the Whisky A Go Go. I was at the Masque when the Bags played because they were one of my favorite bands before I joined. Shortly after that show at the Masque, Alice asked if I would play drums for them. I hadn’t played in many years but couldn’t say no to her.

The Masque was extremely important to the punk scene in Los Angeles. It was our home for a few months at the beginning, and every band from that scene played there. We could do anything we wanted. No pressure to conform or to play music we didn’t like.

Punk Globe: During that time punk was just  exploding in Los Angeles from the bands like The Stooges, MC5 to something new like The Heartbreakers. Who played the most important role in becoming of punk-rock scene in the US ?

Terry: Well, of course, the Ramones were the most important influence. They started punk-rock in all its forms around the world. But there are a lot of creative people in Los Angeles so lots of different types of “punk” bands sprang up almost overnight. In Los Angeles, we did have the benefit of history with so many “garage rock” bands from the 1960s who created a musical foundation. I think we were very much like them. But bands like the Screamers and Weirdos had members from art school and various performance art backgrounds and so created very unique versions of “punk.” It was all about doing what you wanted. No one was a professional, trained musician. We recaptured the spirit of original rock and roll. It was always about crazy, bored kids with instruments. Some could play very well, some could not.

Punk Globe: Speaking of your personal influences, what helped you to form your individual style ?

Terry: My individual style was just a reliance on the music I heard growing up. All that garage band stuff from the 60s. Pretty basic. When I joined Gun Club I discovered that I actually enjoyed playing blues patterns and more traditional forms. But I made most of that up as I went along. But all the music I listened to over the years had some strange, sneaky influences. I hated old country and western, but then discovered that I was playing it!

Punk Globe: With The Gun Club, you started slowly stepping from this general punk-cliche. Your sound become more varied In what was the reaction from your fans who followed you from The Bags to The Gun Club?

Terry: Very few of the old punk rockers liked Gun Club. We weren’t a punk band but often confused for one. Probably because we played fast and were all ex members of punk bands. So we had to find a whole new audience. It was slow going at first but much faster in Europe. We always had mixed reactions in Los Angeles. Hardly anyone came to our shows but we did have a small group of loyalists. Ha, we loved them! Even on our first tour it was difficult because at the time no one knew how or what “punk-blues” meant. We created it so no one knew what to expect. Although the first album was pretty well received, fans were still mostly curious. And, of course, our live shows were often crazy and very noisy. So, It took a while to find a steady following of fans.

Punk Globe: One of the main elements with “Fire Of Love”  of blues and punk-rock . As far as I know Jeffrey Lee was very influenced by the blues. And with it, your drum-parts have a good punk-rock vibes. Was it hard for you to unite these elements into one form ?

Terry: It wasn’t too difficult but did create some interesting challenges. On “Preaching The Blues” I was trying to find ways to play traditional blues licks, but at supersonic speed. I had to mash it all together and create something completely new. I tried to keep one stick in the past, one in the future, so to speak. I don’t know if I succeeded or not.

Punk Globe: Did you all get along? 

Terry: It was not hard to play music together. On stage was often crazy, but it was still fun. It was off stage that we had so many issues. Jeff was a complicated person. He was never quite sure what he wanted to do with the band. That created a lot of conflict. Many people came and went because It was very difficult to maintain one’s sanity with Jeff and his problems with alcohol and drugs.

Punk Globe: In one of your interviews you said that the bad shows were among your favorites. Was important for you, do you feel the band sounded better with the chaos ?

Terry: Yes, we loved chaos. We loved problems on stage. We took all the negative energy and used it for the show. Jeff, Ward and I were snarky smartasses anyway ( laughs). That’s why our shows were sometimes uneven. If the energy was dead, or the audience was quiet, we generally weren’t very good. We needed the electricity, good or bad. We were definitely not a polished act! Often Jeff would insult the crowd just to get something out of them. That ugly, gnarly, dangerous energy was our fuel.

Punk Globe: I have a kind of theory that all great albums and pieces of music are created on a certain edge. Like, with Beethoven who went deaf and then wrote his “Ninth Symphony”. In your book “Punk Like Me” you wrote that the recording of “Miami” was quite difficult experiences for you. Don’t you think that without these difficulties the record would not have been a hit?

Terry: Oh yes! The difficulties matter, they play a big role in the sound, the songs, the whole album. One doesn’t know in the beginning how it all will play out, but the unexpected crap and delays and frustrations and sometimes anger feed into the recording. Very much! I’m glad my experience with Gun Club was often difficult. That’s what made it interesting and gave the music its edge. Miami was different but we felt very good about the songs and ourselves as a band. We all wanted something different from that album. I wanted a bigger, messier sound. Ward wanted a very tight, melodic sound. Not sure what Jeff wanted. It was a transitional time, for sure.

Punk Globe: Once you said that you never considered yourself to be musician. It was at the very beginning of your career – when you moved to the LA, started playing there and writing for your fanzine. But I think in this context “Miami” became quite important record for you. Because, you played your first shows in Europe supporting this record. In what way it was different then playing in LA and in what way you changed your attitude towards yourself after that ?  

Terry: For one thing, the shows in Europe were much bigger! We were made to feel very welcome in Europe so it was quite inspiring to play for audiences who appreciated our work so much. I felt like many of the fans of in Europe paid very close attention to what we did on record and on stage. That kept me on my toes. I really enjoyed playing for them because of that. It’s important to me to play as well as I can for the European fans. They’re fantastic.

Punk Globe:  I read one of your interviews where you were been saying about record-deals and the role of modern digital distribution services in our life. Can you say that back in those days that you had more freedom ?

Terry: No one expected to make any money. We hoped we could. In fact, we hoped young people across the country would turn our way and make punk rock much more popular. We were wrong. Too far ahead of its time. So just making enough money to pay for our tours was quite satisfying. Occasionally, we would earn a lot for larger shows but mostly it was small amounts. I don’t know what we made from record sales because I was never paid anything from that.

Punk Globe: “The Las Vegas Story” was your last album you recorded as a member of The Gun Club. At that point Patricia and Kid Congo joined the band – that quite changed the dynamics of the band. How was different ? 

Terry: Patricia and Kid were very good for Gun Club. Some of our best shows were with that lineup. For one thing, playing in the band was more fun, on the whole. We all knew each other from way back and were genuine friends. Being on the road was easy with those two. The tension was greatly reduced. Musically, we blended very well together. We were all at about the same skill level. Introducing new songs into our set was also very easy and quick. I don’t have a favorite lineup. I really loved playing with Ward and Rob because they were such great musicians but all that matters is the energy on stage. That often has less to do with musicianship and more to do with attitude and low stress.

Punk Globe: I know that now you get a new deal for your recently released book -  “Punk Like Me”. How did you got this idea of writing a book and in what way it was similar to working on a song for you ?

Terry: Well, I decided that it would be best if some way could be found to print the book independently. My girlfriend, Karin, created Lost Word Press and paid for the first and second prints of the book. I could not have done it without her and I’m very glad that’s what we did. She had great ideas for it and we did our best to get the word out. Through Lost Word Press, I was able to control the final manuscript and artwork. Very important for me. And we could control how the book was sold and distributed. Publishing is very expensive and often requires a lot more work than first imagined, but ultimately it’s worth it.

Punk Globe:  You recently co-founded a new band - Apostle of Hex. Could you please tell us about the band?

Terry: My new band is coming along slowly but surely. I wanted to write songs and continue to explore some of the blues and roots music begun with Gun Club. It’s not Gun Club 2.0, but I want to dig around in the graveyard of the blues just a bit more.

Punk Globe: As I understood now you’re working on songs. Any plans for an album ?

Terry: We’ll have our first album out sometime in 2020 but I couldn’t say when. At least not now. I’m anxious as hell to get back in the studio.

Punk Globe: After being musician for many years you tried working as screenwriter, then you wrote your successful memoir-book. So what role does drumming play in your life nowadays ?

Terry: Well now I’m playing again and enjoying it as much as ever. The energy of the young musicians I’ve met and play with is truly inspiring. I’m back in the saddle, for sure, and I like the view from up here.

Punk Globe: You’ve been a part of LA-punk scene since it started itself up to present days. So let me ask you, according to your opinion – what makes this scene so unique and authentic ?

Terry: The LA scene was not what many people thought it was – rich kids playing at music with their parents money. Ignorant bullshit. People from all over the world find themselves in Los Angeles with a guitar and a love of rock music. They come from every imaginable background. Some have money, most don’t. We deal with a strange city that is enormous and sunny and insane and often depressing and lonely. It’s a very difficult place in which to work or create, but that’s the source of our energy and strength. Amongst real fans, I rarely encounter smug or posh attitudes. In fact, I never see that at all. Very real people live in LA. Very real music comes out of LA. Yes, commercial trash used to be a mainstay here but those days are over. Any moron can create a “beat” and talk over it, I guess, but even that has some of it’s most creative expression from people in Los Angeles. So, like it or leave it, LA is anything we want it to be. But it’s up to us to make it interesting. And we will. Depending on the traffic.